observation on my idiolect (cusswords in post)

[rikibeth]

Someone commented, yesterday, on my use of "problematic" in an online discussion. They characterized it as a weak word. I hadn't thought of it that way.

It made me realize something about the way I use words. If I disagree with something, but want to give the speaker/writer the benefit of the doubt for good intentions, the word I tend to use is "misguided."

"Mistaken" is a little stronger than that, when I feel it's more than just a matter of opinion.

The next level up from that is "wrongheaded." This is the polite version of "they have their head wedged up their ass."

By the time I'm dragging out "problematic," I'm going for the G-rated version of "that's some pretty fucked-up shit, right there."

However, I can't expect the rest of the world to have a secret decoder ring for Rikibeth Is Trying Not To Swear.

aren't words cool?

Comments

[shut-me-up.livejournal.com]

Words are very cool! They're among my favorite things.
And I wouldn't even need a decoder ring for you... (or is it shiny? Then maybe...)

[rikibeth.livejournal.com]

Maybe the decoder ring is a Ring Pop. They're shiny and tasty! What's your favorite flavor?

[shut-me-up.livejournal.com]

Oh I'd love that! Strawberry for me please!

[rikibeth.livejournal.com]

Here you go!

http://www.kouponkaren.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/Strawberry-Pop.png

[shut-me-up.livejournal.com]

Perfect!
Thanks!

[inaurolillium.livejournal.com]

I don't think "problematic" is a weak word. I think it expresses its meaning quite precisely: There is a problem with what someone is saying. Implied, but not stated, is "whether or not you mean it to be." It's a word that skips over the entire question of intent, which is a huge derailment and time sink.

It is a diplomatic word, yes, but diplomacy is not weak, although people who go around characterizing words as weak in this sense tend to think it is. They are full of shit. There is a time for diplomacy without cursing, a time for diplomacy with cursing (I have been know to use the phrase "fucking problematic"), and a time for just going for the throat. Some people need to get used to that idea.

Also, I, having been raised Southern, am prone to using, "Bless your heart," and "How nice!"

[rikibeth.livejournal.com]

"Bless your heart" and "How nice!" are both delightful phrases, but work ever so much better when tone of voice is available. Sometimes you can do that online. Sometimes you can't.

Is diplomacy with cursing like diplomacy with lightsabers?

[inaurolillium.livejournal.com]

More like diplomacy with Churchill.

I find that it isn't the tone that communicates the meaning of "bless your heart" and "how nice" -- I'm often misunderstood when I say them in real life, and anyway they're properly said in a sweet-as-pie tone -- but cultural context. If I say "How nice!" to a Southerner, online or off, they're probably going to know exactly what I mean. For a West Coast person, or a New Yorker, to get it, I have to have told them the joke first.

[rikibeth.livejournal.com]

See, it's that sweet-as-pie tone that cues me in that Something Is Going On, Here.

And, yeah, I might not have originally gotten "How nice!" without the joke. "He sent me to charm school!"

[inaurolillium.livejournal.com]

Apparently, that tone does not convey the point to everyone, and many of the people who will get it with the tone will read the words with that tone automatically. That's my experience.

[rikibeth.livejournal.com]

You want amusing, ask mama_hogswatch below about how one of her worst insults is "Cupcake."

[inaurolillium.livejournal.com]

I love it!

It's in the orientation training at my restaurant that, no matter how cranky I sound, I'm not mad at the person I'm addressing unless I start my sentence with honey, sweetie, or darlin'. And how many of those I use is a measure of just how mad I am. They're all terrified of it.

[youraugustine.livejournal.com]

Whereas for a very dear friend of mine (and thus it's creeping into my usage), if he's sprinkling "darlin'"s in there (regardless of your sex), you're probably totally fine.

If he starts leaving them off, it's Serious Talk. And if he says "babe" or "baby", you're in biiiiig trouble.

(His brother uses "sweetheart" to much the same effect.)

Oh communication.

[inaurolillium.livejournal.com]

Oh, all of those words get scattered throughout my speech. It's only when I open with them that there's a problem.

As in, "Honey. Sweetie. Darlin'. Do I understand correctly that you blew off your because you were too stoned to come in to work? Right after I made you a manager?"

Contrast, "Hey, darlin'? Could you pass me that?"

[mama-hogswatch.livejournal.com]

Not an insult. It's a paddle to spank with.

[inaurolillium.livejournal.com]

The phrase "Now listen here, cupcake," springs to mind, as the opening to a thorough explanation of exactly how wrong your target is. Am I in the vicinity of the correct usage?

[rikibeth.livejournal.com]

Ding ding ding!

[mama-hogswatch.livejournal.com]

Exactly right. Said in a Tidewater accent.

As in, when a child is sneaking a cookie, "You sure you wanna be doin' that, cupcake?"

[inaurolillium.livejournal.com]

Very nice. Very nice indeed. Mind if I borrow it?

[starcat-jewel.livejournal.com]

Not having been raised in the South, if I say "How nice!" with that intent, it's probably in conscious imitation of Tom Lehrer in "A Christmas Carol". Which means with an inflection that not even the most tone-deaf are likely to miss. :-)

[mama-hogswatch.livejournal.com]

Anyone who thinks the word "problematic" is a weak word just doesn't know many engineers.

I have made people take a few steps back when saying "How very inconvenient!"

[rikibeth.livejournal.com]

Didn't you get "How very inconvenient!" from my sweet, mildly-spoken Jedi? Since that's her usual way of saying "Oh, SHIT."

[mama-hogswatch.livejournal.com]

Yep.

[gale_storm]

Heh! If something becomes inconvenient, go straight to the Tardis and get the holy F*CK out of there!

[rikibeth.livejournal.com]

She's a Jedi. She has no Tardis!

[gale_storm]

Okay, that's what I would do, then. Okay, IF I had a Tardis. :/

[cbpotts.livejournal.com]

My recent favorite is "It is extremely unlikely that you will change my mind" when what I really wanted to say was not G-rated by any stretch of the imagination.

Apparently it was just as offensive as all the cuss words I would have used normally.

Sometimes you just can't win.

[rikibeth.livejournal.com]

No, sometimes you can't! I was using "problematic" in a frackin' parenthetical note about a famous writer who'd also said some fucked-up shit, when mostly I was saying, "hey, I wonder if that term references this writer." I didn't want to mention her without noting the existence of fucked-up shit in her body of work, but it totally wasn't what the discussion was ABOUT.

[roadnotes.livejournal.com]

Now, see, I switch the order of "problematic" and "wrongheaded." To me, "wrongheaded" is worse, because it has connotations of "there are things you are deliberately ignoring" in my head. But other than that, you make total sense to me.

[rikibeth.livejournal.com]

'S why it's an idiolect. :-)

[dpolicar]

I approve of your usage of "problematic."

My own glossary is something like:

"That's not clear." or "That's questionable." => I don't endorse what you said, but don't yet oppose it. You could convince me, but you haven't yet.

"That's misleading." => I oppose the most likely meaning of what you said, but I can see alternative things you might potentially have meant by it that I endorse or could be convinced to endorse.

"That's simply false." => I oppose what you said, not just as a matter of alignment or principle, but as a question of fact. That said, perhaps it's a peripheral aspect of what you are trying to get at and I'm focusing on a tangent; you're free to drop it and take a different tack.

"That's problematic." => I don't necessarily oppose what you said, but it seems to entail other things that I do oppose. If you want my endorsement, you're going to have to show me how those things don't actually follow from what you said.

"That's insane/incoherent/nonsense/wrong." => I oppose not only what you said, but also what I believe you meant by it. (The words aren't interchangeable; they indicate different kinds of opposition.)

[soon_lee]

There are people who choose words carefully, with intent aforethought. And there are those who don't.

Mine tend to range from, "That's interesting", to "That's unwise". Unless I've blown a gasket, in which case, "That's wrong!" followed by a rant on why that is the case.

I don't see "problematic" as weak at all, unless it's used in fora where stronger words are the norm.

Context & tone can count for a lot; I'm tone-deaf to some of the US region-specific usages for example.

[rikibeth.livejournal.com]

In the particular forum where I was using it (an online one), it would have been acceptable to use the colloquial translation of "fucked-up," and probably would have conveyed my meaning better.

[fairylogic.livejournal.com]

I use "problematic" much the same way. Also "unfortunate" when something is fucked up but I don't want to particularly place blame.

[rikibeth.livejournal.com]

Whereas I'd put "unfortunate" more around the level of "misguided" or "mistaken," because of the not-blaming. It carries, for me, a connotation of "I still on the whole like this person or body of work, and wish this one bit weren't in here." "Problematic" is top-level OH NO SHE DI'INT stuff, and if I'm dragging it out, it means that the thing I'm calling out with it has potentially tainted the rest of it. The only thing I've got worse is "horrifying."